Did Buddy Rich ever really call out and challenge Ginger Baker?
I believe they did have a drum battle some time in the early 70's, but I don't think there were any bad feelings surrounding it -- it was well known that Ginger was a big fan of Buddy Rich, so I think it was just a friendly duel between two greats, one from the old wave and one from the new. Maybe I haven't watched enough interviews of Ginger, but I never got the impression that he was particularly arrogant or superficial. Crotchety certainly -- and there's a lot of bad blood between him and Jack Bruce. That tension helped make Cream an exciting and powerful act, but it was also responsible for their swift break-up. Edit: I stand corrected, he is pretty arrogant. I just read an interview where he bashed The Beatles and The Rolling Stones, and ridiculed the talents of Ringo Starr (understandable, but I disagree), Charlie Watts (!?), John Bonham (!?!?), Mitch Mitchell (!?!?!?) and Keith Moon (!?!?!?!?!?!?!...add about a hundred more).
A long time ago a letter appeared in the New York post office addressed simply to "The Greatest Drummer In The World." A postal worker who was a music fan decided that it must have been meant for Gene Krupa and sent it to him. Krupa looked at the envelope and said, "No, I'm not the *greatest* drummer, this must be for Kenny Clarke" and gave it to Clarke. Clarke looked at the envelope and said, no, no way, this should go to Max Roach. Roach got the letter and said, "Naw, but I know who this should go to" and passed it along, unopened. This went on for a while, with all the greatest drummers in jazz passing the envelope on to someone else, till it arrived in the hands of Buddy Rich. Rich said "of course, it's for me!" and ripped the envelope open gleefully. With great anticipation, he began to read: "Dear Ringo...."
Keith Moon, John Bonham, or Ginger Baker?
John Bonham. He did more- just like a good jazz drummer- on a smaller kit than either of the other two. And I don't know if it was the way he tuned his drums or the the way Page and the engineers recorded him (or both), but he had the better drum sound, too. (Not saying Moon was bad- he certainly wasn't- and I'm actually a fan of Baker's jazz-type projects, mind you.)
Who was (is) the better drummer, Ringo Starr or Ginger Baker of "Cream"?
Doxie, is 100% on the money. Buddy Rich was definitely quite the drummer. We had one of his albums. The guy could really get tap happy. Clapton with Cream, yes, I remember it well. I tried my darndest to get mom and dad to paint my room white so I could have black curtains! Didn't happen though. oops, sorry, forgot to answer your orginal Q. Of the two, I would say Ginger Baker over Ringo Starr. :)
I sure wish people asking these questions would add a comment to give some context. Where does someone even get this idea? Is it some friend who listens to 250-bpm death metal and thus says Baker is hopelessly simple, slow, and incompetent?Anyhow… I can’t say how Ginger Baker *is* because I haven’t heard his drumming lately. I’d say at the age of nearly 80 he’s probably not as good as he used to be.
It's Thunderdome time: Ginger Baker -vs- Neal Peart?
Both of them suck. Peart uses more complex techniques and Baker comes out of a tradition. But both are really sloppy, disjointed, and boring. Peart has more respect among some schools of thought so I have to give it to him. But like in an episode of Freaks and Geeks when the drummer kid keeps going off about how great Peart is, the dad shows him Buddy Rich and his reaction was "how do they even do that!"
Some would say, Yes. They say that because of Buddy’s “fire” to lead a band. Few have ever displayed such energy and control at the instrument. His style is something that retains admiration. He made the most difficult things look easy to do.We must define “great,” though. There are drummers that have and do move as fast or faster than Buddy. They display the same or better technique. The world now showcases drum set artists when in Buddy’s time it was something that showcased in America and parts of Europe.At one time there were few who would venture to sit on the same stage with Buddy trading licks. Today, I imagine there would be many if he were here in his prime.Buddy had phenomenal natural talent, tremendous hand and foot control, and a drive that just excelled. It worked well with jazz/big band. Rock changed a lot of that. Time keeping changed with the music, and technique was greatly simplified. Fusion brought it back, and turned it around some, incorporating both styles of jazz and rock. As jazz has greatly dropped off in popularity the mystique of Buddy Rich just gained ground.Buddy remains in the class he is as much for the music he played night after night, which is a far more challenging music to play than rock. His skills just increased with age. Before video his skills just seemed magical. Video allowed people close-up examination of his technique and with that, a heightened respect but, also, development of technique among those who learned from Buddy’s. Today, many can do what he did. That said, Buddy remains “the greatest” because he pioneered it all, inspired by others before him.
Rank from 1-7: Keith Mooon, John Bonham, Neil Peart, Buddy Rich, Ringo, Ginger Baker, Gene Kupa?
My opinion 1. Keith Moon- I love his craziness on the kit and he could explode on a kit like no one else, i love the who so i guess it's not fair but he maybe the reason I loved the who 2. John Bonham- amazing drummer but i prefer Moon. had repitive beats during Zeppelin's songs but his beats were great. The triplet king 3. Buddy Rich- I know he wasn't great at making "attractive" beats, but no one will ever have as quick hands as he had 4.Ginger Baker- loved the way he used the bass drum and could explode on a kit 5. Gene Kupa- a little slower than Rich but beats were at least twice as "attractive" 6. Neil Peart- a great drummer but thought he could of showed of his skills a little bit more. His drum part on tom sawyer is the only reason i like the song 7. Ringo- If Keith Moon and Bonham never came along, Ringo would be a lot more highly praised. Sorta simple catchy beats made him great. His son ain't so bad either This is actually pretty hard to do. What u guys think?
Whereas I don't like these types of generalizations on who's better than who, I figured this would be a good one to throw my opinion in the mix. Copeland is by far measure a more prolific percussionist and producer as well as being a very well respected drummer who incorporated mutiple styles into his playing. Baker wore a cape on stage and played with Eric Clapton and a few other guys here and there.As a drummer/percussionist for the past 30 years, I have heard many drummers who got more credit than what they deserved. Baker is one of them.Go on YouTube and search each one. Baker is very unschooled and sloppy, his creativity comes more from the drugged state he was in half the time, and never garnered the larger support from drum fans other than eccentricities and being associated with Clapton.Copeland is a very technical and creative player who's solos speak for themselves, his most popular work exemplifies a seamless and provocative blending of musical styles that were very progressive for their time period.However, it is more than a singular player that makes a band work. It's chemistry. Imagine switching the two drummers in each band. It just would not be the same. Therefor.....Copeland was the best drummer for the Police and Baker was the best drummer for Cream. All else is commentary. Chemistry of musicians matters most.